Comments on: Faith, Trust and Respect

By: Ossie Jesson 54 yrs old and still learning

Ossie Jesson 54 yrs old and still learning — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 10:55:46 +0000

How far to go to get the trust for the business
To straighten out the uncle ,patronizing cautious type you could at the right time and in appropriate language ask this open question

Well sir /madam can you,have you , at this present time been able to find a web development service with better credentials ,resources and proven abilities to do the task your wanting done than ours . ?

Yes . . . well sir/ madam what are you sitting talking to me for ?
No well sir/ madam sign here . We’ll be starting work on your project later today .

Speaking as a 54 uncle ,patronizing cautious type we seem to want to be recognized as having been around the block a bit and survived. Hey if we are still trading profitabley and look like we can give you some work and ,pay you for it without you employing a lawyer !!!
Surely we need a little sucking up to for our old sliver back status but only just enough sucking up to because . ..
the reson we tallkingt to you young guns is … is you have what we want and need and without you perhaps we wont be trading profitably for much longer.

The age patronizing bit of the deal is just a part of the mix tha exists in any trading relationship tha has to be handled wisely and appropiatley like any other part of the mix

So bottom line how far should you go .. just far enough so that both parties get what they want and stike a deal or part to get on with their respective businesses .

By: Zinni

Zinni — Sun, 08 Jun 2008 18:52:43 +0000

I know that I do not know all of the sides of this situation, but to me it sounds like you have already made up your mind. I would just tell the guy the project is never going to work out if he is not willing to trust you as a business. Tell him that you have given him more than enough reassurance, and if he gets over it that he can always call you later to restart the project. I would do this in a very professional manner, but I would also make it very clear that you are not in the business of being intimidated or abused.

Chances are the guy thinks that he can use his age as a way to pressure you into a more subservient role and make demands he knows he wouldn’t otherwise be able to during the project.

I would instead focus this time you are spending on finding new marketing methods, or maybe even calling a couple of prospects you have scoped out already. Replace all this wasted time with productive time and you will most likely make out better in the long run.

By: Dev Basu

Dev Basu — Fri, 06 Jun 2008 19:20:31 +0000

Some people never change Verne. A friend of mine was proposed to do a large scale SEO op on someone’s site for free, because the client thought it’d be good ‘volunteer’ experience for the ‘young’in’. If a client is not desirable enough to have as a future reference, or in my portfolio, then that’s a client I’d rather not have. In the case that I cannot (or do not) want to work with a prospective client that has been referred to me, I usually try to pass them on to someone else that can possibly fulfill their needs. Nota bene: I let them know that I can’t vouch for the quality of the other person’s/agency’s work, but that I’ve heard good things about them — Dev

By: RWeiss

RWeiss — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:47:14 +0000

Besides… you may find that by standing your ground and showing you are willing to walk away (”from a position of strength” as Brian Fleming said), this person may respect you more and possibly … it’s a long shot I know… *ahem* give them food for thought.
Good luck!

By: Verne

Verne — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 14:48:29 +0000

Brian & RWeiss, thanks for the reinforcing and encouraging words of wisdom! Both of you are right that we need simply stand our ground and bluntly state that it’s simply not a good match.

LaurenMarie - No, I didn’t know that such a feature existed! I definitely will look into it and see if we can get some of our work up. Thanks for passing it along! :)

By: RWeiss

RWeiss — Wed, 04 Jun 2008 15:30:22 +0000

In spite of the fact that you say this potential client is a referral, my recommendation is to sit down with them and bluntly state that you are sorry, but it would appear their project and your firm are not a good match for each other and to decline their business, and walk away.
Follow up with the person who gave the referral. Thank them very much for actively supporting your firm and make sure they know the basic/high-level business reasons why you chose not to take on this particular referral client. Reinforce that in spite of the fact that this one may not have resulted in additional business for you, that they should not hesitate to refer other possible clients your way.
If the strength of the referring person’s opinion, along with the evidence you have provided to-date are not enough to convince this person they wish to sign with you, then trust me, you DO NOT want their business… if you push them to sign, it will likely turn out to cause more fuss and trouble than the resulting project is worth.
You can’t force yourself on a client. Go search out a better fit where both parties will be satisfied.

By: LaurenMarie - Creative Curio

LaurenMarie - Creative Curio — Wed, 04 Jun 2008 04:13:31 +0000

Aw Verne, you’re welcome! I hope things work out ok. You wouldn’t be a designer if you didn’t experience problematic clients! It gives us all something to commiserate about :P

Hey, have you ever thought of submitting your design firm to Communications Arts’ Fresh feature?!

By: Brian Fleming

Brian Fleming — Wed, 04 Jun 2008 03:45:51 +0000

The hardest thing to do in business is to not gravel for business. Present from a position of strength - if a potential client doesn’t see value in your proposition - manage your resources and move on. You can’t please or do business with everyone.

By: Verne

Verne — Tue, 03 Jun 2008 15:06:09 +0000

@MIchael - One of the reasons we’re reluctant to forget the client is because they’re a referral as well. It makes it that much tougher when a past client has sent them to you and told them that “Verne will take care of you”. But like you said, it comes a time to balance out whether it’s worth the end result. I think the whole situation’s currently hanging by a thread, so one more hoop is certainly going to result in someone being dropped.

@LaurenMarie - You rock! Thanks for the uplifting words! :) I’d definitely love to pass it onto another designer but a) I’d be ashamed to pass on such a troublesome client (their predisposition on young talent isn’t the only headache) and b) doing so only further reinforces their ideas. Must… keep… on… trucking!

@Winnie - I think you’re right that this behavior is likely to transcend into the creative process - a nightmare to even think about. I prefer to stay optimistic and give people the benefit of the doubt, so we’ll see what happens! Thanks for your 2 cents. :)

By: Winnie Lim

Winnie Lim — Tue, 03 Jun 2008 06:17:54 +0000

I personally believe that the client-designer relationship needs to have chemistry, just like all relationships do. It is reasonable for clients to have doubts, but if he/she is being stereotypical, it is very likely that he/she will apply the same mentality to all other areas as well, including the possibility of being close-minded to your creative ideas. If the client doesn’t have faith in you, I think there is no point convincing him/her otherwise. The ideal client hires you based on your work and you, and this is the sort of client that will provide positive energy to your work and you. :) My two cents.